Bean

LINK

So basically they want to make human/animal hybrids with the promise that some unsrupulous idiot isn't going to go further than embryonic research with it.

To start, I'm all for stem cell research. I don't look at an embryo as a child. I look at it as a mass of cells that has the potential to become a child. I'm sure some of you may not share that view, but that's not what I'm arguing here. I just wanted to be clear.

This is one of the most sickening things I've ever heard of. True, by my above opinion, it's not actually anything more than a lump of cells. But this is just the tiniest fraction into how far research like this could actually be taken. How long before the stigma of what these people are doing fades and the boundaries are pushed a little further. This is human nature. This is the way everything happens in modern society. From music, to advertising, to medical research. Each year, the standards on what is "appropriate" get a little more lax. The new "level" further desensitizes us, and we push the boundary further again.

To start down that slope, with research like this is not only irresponsible in the most obscene way possible, it's disgusting.

Thoughts?

__________________
"I haven't faced death. I've cheated death. I've tricked my way out of death and patted myself on the back for my ingenuity. I know nothing."

--James T. Kirk

Cymro

"God Schmod, I want my monkey-man!"

I pretty much disagree with you on most of this. I don't really think the slippery slope argument holds any water, and I don't think that there's anything wrong with what they're going to be doing.

They're not even mixing DNA, they're basically using the animal egg cell, emptying out all the "animal" parts and putting in human parts, they swap around the DNA from various women's egg cells all the time, which I'd bet a bunch of Jehova's witnesses are still complaining about. Since most of the people who complain about this sort of thing are paedophiles or spend every Sunday listening to paedophiles, I'm not really worried. Their argument is based on some passage in the first draft of Lord of the Rings anyway.

I know where you're coming from, though, there is definitely something weird about it, but I can't think of any rational argument against it. As for the slippery slope...I don't see it, and I don't really know what you mean as far as people becoming desensitized. If you're talking about stuff like gay marriage and porn and the Dutch - that stuff should be legal anyway.

__________________
"Let me tell you something about humans, nephew: They're a wonderful, friendly people - as long as their bellies are full and their holosuites are working.

"But take away their creature comforts, deprive them of food, sleep, sonic showers, put their lives in jeopardy over an extended period of time and those friendly, intelligent, wonderful people...will become as nasty and as violent as the most blood-thirsty klingon."

Bean

What I mean about desensitized is this. Forgive the analogy, but it works.

40 years ago, to openly admit to having a fondness for porn would have gotten you socially ostracized. You would have been treated like a pedophile is treated now. Skip ahead to present day, and porn is an 8 billion dollar industry that is "accepted". Maybe not approved my mainstream society, but accepted nonetheless.

Same thing with this. Right now, people, such as yourself above, don't find this to be disgusting. You acknowledge that it's weird, but accept it. In 20 years time, who's to say that we don't go from this, to actual blending of DNA etc....

It's the slippery slope argument you mention. Unfortunately for your statement, it does hold water, and can be proven with almost any area of advancement in the last few decades. You start with a little that "isn't bothering anyone" and then a couple of decades later, the floodgates are open.

As for gay marriage etc... different argument, I'm all for that.

__________________
"I haven't faced death. I've cheated death. I've tricked my way out of death and patted myself on the back for my ingenuity. I know nothing."

--James T. Kirk

Cymro

Well, yeah, who wouldn't be outside the Jesus fanclub? But that is also a slippery slope because when my dad was a kid, beating the shit out of a homo was completely acceptable and just being a homo was a criminal offense. People were probably speaking of a slippery slope when they legalised homosexuality. People are still saying that "If a man can marry a man, next on the list is a man can marry his cow or his 5 year old nephew".

I suppose it's the way you see it - what's wrong with porn, what's wrong with gay marriage, premarital sex, smoking the ganja etc? We can't think of anything with secular reasoning - the same secular reasoning that says that abortions must take place before the end of the first trimester (which is a closed book issue in the UK and most places not populated by catholics). an It's the same reasoning that says that we should not allow a hybrid "monkey-man" or whatever to develop into more than an embryo because that embryo would still be human and if it were to develop it would essentially be a labrat which is a complete breach of human rights.

But at the end of the day, regardless of how you might feel about it, I think the Dutch argument is very potent. Would you rather people be doing this legally under public scrutiny or illegally? The scientists have access to all the equipment and I doubt it's that hard to get your hands on a cow egg...so....

__________________
"Let me tell you something about humans, nephew: They're a wonderful, friendly people - as long as their bellies are full and their holosuites are working.

"But take away their creature comforts, deprive them of food, sleep, sonic showers, put their lives in jeopardy over an extended period of time and those friendly, intelligent, wonderful people...will become as nasty and as violent as the most blood-thirsty klingon."

Stag

WAIT A MINUTE ... It is legal to marry a cow?!?!?

__________________
"I want to do a motorboat on Shatner's manboobs" - Sam Cogley

Cymro

Only in Arkansas.

__________________
"Let me tell you something about humans, nephew: They're a wonderful, friendly people - as long as their bellies are full and their holosuites are working.

"But take away their creature comforts, deprive them of food, sleep, sonic showers, put their lives in jeopardy over an extended period of time and those friendly, intelligent, wonderful people...will become as nasty and as violent as the most blood-thirsty klingon."

Bean

You can marry a sheep in Wales.

__________________
"I haven't faced death. I've cheated death. I've tricked my way out of death and patted myself on the back for my ingenuity. I know nothing."

--James T. Kirk

Cymro

No, you can only get a Civil Union.

__________________
"Let me tell you something about humans, nephew: They're a wonderful, friendly people - as long as their bellies are full and their holosuites are working.

"But take away their creature comforts, deprive them of food, sleep, sonic showers, put their lives in jeopardy over an extended period of time and those friendly, intelligent, wonderful people...will become as nasty and as violent as the most blood-thirsty klingon."

Bean

Oh, my bad.

__________________
"I haven't faced death. I've cheated death. I've tricked my way out of death and patted myself on the back for my ingenuity. I know nothing."

--James T. Kirk

Stag

Really, can you get the terms correct.

__________________
"I want to do a motorboat on Shatner's manboobs" - Sam Cogley